Clinical psychologist Dr. Sheryl Ziegler, author of "The Crucial Years," joins "CBS Mornings" to discuss how parents can help children navigate puberty, peer pressure and social media during the middle school years.

Middle school remains a challenging period for children as they navigate puberty, develop their identities, and encounter new social dynamics, including the rise of social media. Clinical psychologist Dr. Cheryl Ziegler highlights that while some aspects of middle school are timeless, such as peer pressure and bullying, new challenges have emerged, making this stage particularly complex.

Dr. Ziegler notes that bullying peaks between the ages of 11 and 14, with verbal bullying being the most common and harmful. She advises that children should be encouraged to stand up for themselves in a firm but non-confrontational manner, and emphasizes the importance of supporting both victims and witnesses of bullying. The discussion also acknowledges the emotional impact on all parties involved, including the bullies themselves.

Navigating the social minefield of middle school

This morning we're continuing our back to school series highlighting a uniquely famously difficult time for kids. I'm talking about middle school, a period when children are entering puberty. They're defining their identities, figuring themselves out, getting on social media, learning how to deal with their peers and peer pressure. And as kids head back to the classroom, it is also a good time for parents to learn about the social minefield of modern middle school. Some things have changed, but some things are very much the same. We're joined now by clinical psychologist Dr. Cheryl Ziegler. She's the author of a fantastic book. It's called The Crucial Years, The Essential Guide to Mental Health and Modern Puberty in Middle Childhood. Great to have you here, Dr. Ziegler. So in some ways middle school is timeless. It doesn't change, but in some ways it's different and the challenges are new. Talk about these new challenges. Talk about challenges. Tony, I know people to this day that can still be reduced to tears because of things that have happened to them. I won't cry, but I remember all the names I was called. You won't cry, but people will cry. It's like this period of time that has an imprint that it leaves on us. And there's good reason for that. So the things that stay the same, we all know, right? The kids that are being mean, the kids that are name-calling, you're awkward, you're growing. Some are not, some are. But one of the things about it is you connect with kids. When you're a kid, you're playing, and that's how you're connecting. When you go to middle school, all of a sudden it's about your identity. And everybody's trying to figure out their identity while they're growing at different rates. Some are putting makeup on, and some want to be older, and some want to be still little kids. And so that mismatch is part of what makes this so incredibly difficult. Isn't bullying at its highest in middle school? Is there an age range for bullying? Yep, bullying peaks between the ages of 11 and 14. So that is right there in middle school. And, you know, I think some of the things that have changed are verbal bullying is still the most common and the most harmful. So being called names and those kinds of things, that's what brings people to tears. And they can be 40, 50 years old remembering how awful. So, doctor, I had a father who watches our show, came up to me recently and said, can you talk to my young daughter who's being bullied at school? Because I've heard you mention how you were bullied at school because you had esoteric taste in music and in film and in books. And she's like that, and I want her to meet you so she can see what's possible. But I remember thinking to myself, I don't really know what to say because what worked for me might not work for a young child today in 2025. Her name is Rory Carson. So what would you say to Rory who's navigating this because of just her interest, not because of anything else? Absolutely. I would say to Rory, you have to kind of go through this stage and be patient with it, knowing who you are within yourself. If someone really is bullying you, the best thing we know through the data is you got to stand up for yourself. And I know that that's scary because they're like, oh, my gosh, no, you don't understand my life. When you said you have to go through it, I was saying, are you saying they have to accept bullying? Not accept it. They have to go through the process of like, OK, I'm being called names and I need to figure out who I am. That's the identity. Like, I need to figure out I like that, but I like this music. So she can talk to somebody and go, but they said that music was stupid, but I like it. The going through it is like, and you keep liking it and you keep showing up and speaking up or doing something to sort of protect that piece. When she gets to 14 or 15, she's going to love all those things about herself. Dr. Ziegler, here's a real life parenting conundrum, and I've had differences of opinion with my wife on this. If your kid is name called, do you tell them to turn the other cheek or do they name call back? Do you get into the mix or not? That's a really good question. Something in the middle. Something in the middle. You say back, you know, that's not very nice that you said that about me. I really like my clothes or I really like that music. I liked that movie. Right. And they're like, oh, well, that's too stupid or whatever else. Well, I like it. You say it firm. You say it strong and you say it to their eye. You don't have to go down to their level and start calling their names. But also when you walk away and things like that, which some kids do, it tends to keep it going. And I will say one other thing. Watching bullying, being the witness to it is also traumatic. So when we look at the research, we say it's really hard for kids to watch because they'll come home and tell their parents, so and so is not nice to so and so, but I don't know what to do. And then there's that guilt of like, what should I be doing? So this affects everyone. The kid who's doing the bullying is also in pain in some way. Yes. Right. So we've got that person. We've got the victim and we've got the witnesses. Sometimes when they're confronted, they back down, too. It tends to. You say, that wasn't nice. That wasn't fair. Why did you say that? Right.

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